The Lord of the Rings. But Saruman was always too prideful for his companions. Hes of the same order of beings as Sauron, so he certainly has enough power to effectively use the ring. No one could even comprehend the length of His existence. The one ring would have made him more like what he was before he left on his mission to middle-earth, only corrupted and evil. Both the direct and symbolic aspects could have helped Saruman expand his empire by winning adherents and frightening potential opponents. As such, Saruman wouldn't have been able to use the Ring against Sauron, per se. Which probably wouldn't have happened. In those, Saruman appears to harness the weather to command the snowstorm on the pass of Caradhras that dramatically halts the progress of the Fellowship. He's the anti-hero in his own story who spends time with the Blue Wizards in the East, heads up the White Council, and eventually . The one, and the nine created fearful dominance, fraught with majesty, and terror. The first and most obvious reason Galadriel gets to hang on to her Ring - Nenya, the Ring of Water - from beginning (i.e. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Other. Knowing where he ends up would make the Strangers current journey all the more fascinating. Hidden realms of elves in the past had undone the plans of Morgoth himself, and Sauron was not likely to let such a thing go unchallenged. It only takes a minute to sign up. If he didn't get the Truth from Saruman, he could get it from the halflings and if they were dead due to Saruman, capture and question any of Saruman's orcs or men roaming between Isengard and the Black Gate. All credit must go to the talented artists. First its a lucky hit, now its a super-human with a magical super-sword? It was literally Sauron's essence made into an inanimate object. In his mind, it was the only logical thing to do, and he offered Gandalf a place by his side. He wanted the One Ring. He also had control of the nine kings and such or was supposed to, although didn't Elrond get a ring yet was present at the battle? When the Valar realized Sauron had returned, they sent the Istari to help the peoples of Middle-earth. Keep Your Powder Dry: Firearms for 5E Fantasy CampaignsNearly 40 firearms with customization options for 5E games, plus magic items, feats for gunslingers, and the alchemist character class! In the appendices it mentions the three assaults on Lorien, during the final days of the struggle. Would Saruman have been able to defeat Sauron with the power of the One Ring? We learn that Denethor, steward of Gondor, had used the Palantir to divine knowledge of the Enemys movements only just before the steward burns himself alive. Middle-earth & J.R.R. This one, too, was controlled by Sauron. Could he really do anything with it? Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. the scene in which Gandalf, say, was placed in such a position. They sang in the Music or the Ainur and were commanders of Morgoth's armies. **, And this kind of begs the question - What had been done with the three? Saruman had decided to abandon his mission as an Istari and join Sauron in subjugating Middle-earth. Here's a new theory concerning Saruman and Grima. He believed that Sauron would never return, so he had his own set of schemes. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. The Lord Of The Rings. 2 What would happen if Gandalf had the ring? For these reasons, Tolkien tells us, the Nazgul (powerful though they were) would have hesitated to attack Frodo directly, after Frodo finally claimed the Ring for his own. The Ring still wants to be with its true master. Rather, Saruman would have had to dominate Sauron's will and essentially kick him out of the Ring. Saruman volunteered. He now lives with his family in Lynchburg VA and is an avid outdoorsman. What is the significance of Saruman's Ring? Amy Ratcliffe is the Editor-in-Chief for Nerdist and the author ofStar Wars: Women of the Galaxy, The Art of Star Wars: Galaxys Edge, The Jedi Mind, and more. He fought Uruk-hai (who had captured Merry and Pippin thinking they were Frodo) and were enroute to Isengard. Why Rings of Powers Fight Scenes Are Boring. That was a lucky hitand did you perhaps notice that Sauron was more or less single-handedly beating the entire Last Alliance army at that point? The White Wizard put Isengard at Sauron's disposal until his armies were defeated at Helms Deep and his staff was broken by the resurrected Gandalf. Through them Tolkien shows Faramir and Eomer's quality was in not being blind followers of loyalty and obedience to king and father but seeing a bigger picture and being obedient to a greater purpose. He still had the nine, and perhaps some of the seven. We don't know enough about the powers of the Ring, in the hands of an ambitious wizard how it might have worked as a "devastating weapon" (Letter 246), how, as a symbol, it might in Saruman's hands have affected Sauron's servants and vassals. Indeed, Saruman needed no ring to become enslaved. When Sauron thought Aragorn had the Ring, he reacted with a swift military offensive. The Silmarillion says Saruman was the eldest Istari and came first. After all, they would both want the other one's full and utter . If he followed the strategy I've mentioned, his fighters would have to deal with the feisty Rohirrim, and would also run the risk of a flank attack from Gondor, before they could even get near Isengard. Ummm, thats what the One Ring does for someone who has zero magical ability. I think Saruman would have kept the Ring and used its real and symbolic powers to contest with Sauron for control over Middle-earth by building up his own empire. I think the real point has been missed. When Gandalf meets Saruman in Orthanc, he notices that Saruman is wearing a ring. Exactly. So, it seems Sauron is not invincible, even with the ring, much less against it. Gandalf had the last one, though Im not sure anyone but Cirdan, Himself, and Elrond and Galadriel knew it. What would have happened if Saruman had gotten the One Ring? That's information that either could potentially use to tip the balance, but perhaps Saruman would also have had awareness that a contest with Sauron was one that he couldn't possibly win? He would simply wait and let the Ring do what it was made to do. And in The Rings of Power, when the mystics realized their error, they said the Stranger is the Istarnot one of the Istari, the Istar, as if only one is present in Middle-earth right now. Chief among the powers of the ring that were feared by the White Council was the fact that if Sauron put it on now, all that had been done by the Wise using the three rings would be revealed to him, as would their minds, if they did not take off the rings. We dont know if the Stranger will make it to his destination and the show could certainly deviate from lore or invent new history ( as it has done already). It was his own and under his will. Whats the threshold of power for a wielder of the one ring to defeat Sauron? If Saruman had the ring and he learned to master it, he could rule Sauron's armies and servants as it says in The Fellowship Of The Ring. Yet, it's also possible that Sauron would have triumphed and regained the Ring for himself. (Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age, The Silmarillion as far as the quoted material here goes). It was never explained how, but the Elves found a way to block Saurons sight from their Rings. Since Sauruman was once justly revered as among the great, by such as Elrond, and even Gandalf, it seems that he might well have been able to use the ring against Sauron successfully. Sauron was stronger than Gandalf the Grey, but . Although this is never explicitly stated, Galadriel alluded to the Fact that Gandalf, . Sauron once again lay dormant for over a millennium in the Second Age, secretly preparing another attempt to take over Middle-earth. Or perhaps his lust for power would have blinded him to that? I think people project a kind of loaded weapon mentality onto the rings which is misleading. We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup, Latest Blog Post: Jacks Bad Movies Black Adam (2022). 3 Why didnt Gandalf use the giant eagles? Sarumaon told Gandalf that a new power was rising and noone could srand and therefore they should join that power. mostly minifigs and decorated bricks. Had Isuldur done the wise thing, and pitched that sucker in the crack of doom, that would have been it. But there are important differences between Saruman's position, if he had taken the Ring in Isengard, and Frodo's position when he claimed the Ring in Mordor. Powered by Discourse, best viewed with JavaScript enabled. The first thing you need to realize is just how long a gap there was between the two trilogies. Thus, while Gandalf taking the One Ring would have expediated the destruction of Sauron, it also would have hasted the subjugation of Middle-earth. Anybody else who bore it (non-stop) would eventually be drawn to him, where he would get the Ring back. Although he never appears directly in the books and is only shown in the movies in a flashback to the War of the Last Alliance, his corruptive influence is felt nearly everywhere in Middle-Earth. What can a lawyer do if the client wants him to be acquitted of everything despite serious evidence? He would have been able to control more people, and he would have had a much easier time dominating their wills. But it will still never truly be his & he will have to continually fight to dominate it as the One Ring wants to return to its master, who cannot be banished until the Ring is destroyed. It's possible Saruman would have been able to defeat Sauron. In what way? Answer (1 of 13): If Saruman acquired the One Ring and had time to learn to use it, then he would go to war against Sauron. The three, which Celebrimbor made, were not made to gain dominion over others. Unfortunately, Sauron had got on the wrong side of a particularly powerful race: the Nmenreans.The isle of Nmenr was a realm of men that sat apart from Middle-earth and those who lived there were more powerful than the men seen elsewhere in The Lord of . Probably, upon creation, Saruman was weaker than Gandalf and Sauron, and he spent his entire existence trying to increase his power, leading to his jealousy of Gandalf and eventual betrayal. However, The Lord of the Rings TV series still left plenty of questions for future seasons. In Middle-earth history, it seems likely Saruman arrived before Gandalf did. Gandalf & Galadriel admitted they would eventually fall to evil will of Sauron through the One Ring. Eomer had no clue about rings and quests. Is he stronger than the will of the ring? This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. It would have been the master in the end. Orcs are poster children for corruption, and plague the Fellowship throughout the novels. By the end of Return of the King, Saruman has lost his powers and has resorted to becoming a lowly criminal. Gandalf, however, likely took Saruman's position, not knowing that Saruman had invented the story of it washing out to sea and was looking for the One Ring for himself. The power they have is to give stature to the wearer in the minds of others, and to enhance the emotional strength of the wearer, in the manner desired by their maker. Saruman wants to be Sauron's . Tolkien Blog - by Michael Martinez Would Saruman have been able to defeat Sauron? He eventually became the leader of the Istari because of all of them, he had most studied the devices of Sauron of old. In other words, he learned about dark magic and Ringlore and knew the enemy the best of the Istari. His Spirit would continue in some astral realm, and would use His real weapon: TIME. This is what Sauron feared that his enemies would do, if they got the Ring; and that's the only reason he feared them. Saruman wasnt an elf, or even a man. The heroes in The Lord of the Rings did everything to keep the One Ring away from Sauron, but what would have happened if Saruman had gotten it? All betting content is intended for an . He is Maiar. In fact, he had started searching for the . House of Dragons vs. A normal man with a normal sword would probably have failed miserably even if he had got in the lucky hit. Be specific and add in your sources, we prefer not to have speculation here. However, Saruman had planned his rise to power much earlier than that. My understanding of the crushingly unavoidable fate which is the history of Middle Earth says that the One Ring belongs to Sauron and no other. When Sauron was in Dol Guldur, he lay dormant most of the time. They are not beasts. Luckily, Gandalf refused, and the rest of the trilogy didn't play out in Saruman's favor. Sauron would then have suspended his campaign against Minas Tirith, and instead sent his armies north-west, through Rohan towards Isengard. And so that's what Gandalf was pretending to do, while they were actually taking the Ring to Mt. Sauron was the Dark Lord in The Lord of the Rings saga, written by J.R.R. A capable bearer would have all that power, plus whatever native power he or she had to begin with. " The Hunt for the Ring " is a chapter in Unfinished Tales, a posthumously published work of J.R.R. My own feeling is that since it takes time to learn to master the Ring (also Letter 246), Sauron would have had to pay a visit immediately and before Saruman had the time to achieve this mastery. You also have the option to opt-out of these cookies. Would Sauron be able to open two fronts, battling against Isengard and Gondor? Why are Suriname, Belize, and Guinea-Bissau classified as "Small Island Developing States"? When given the opportunity It would betray Its wearer, and find Its way back to Its Master. What Would Happen if Saruman Got the One Ring in LOTR? Whether he judged correctly is another matter, but I would expect it to be a contest. But I've been thinking. Gandalf wasn't even sure if he would be able to break his staff in The Return of the King, and that was a very weakened version of Saruman. Even some of the imagery in his scenes screams Gandalf. Soon (convenient term, soon) I will begin on the second volume of The Lord of the Rings, The Two Towers.It consists of two 'books', The Treason of Isengard and The Ring Goes East.The first 'book' of the volume deals with the adventures of Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas as they go in search of Merry and Pippin; this puts them all in conflict with the traitorous wizard Saruman's machinations. In the hypothetic situation where Sauron thought, or knew, that Saruman had the Ring, I think he would have responded in a similar way. Either way Sauron would've just destroyed him at some point if he got the ring back; Saruman getting the Ring is another . What exactly happened to Sauron when the Ring was destroyed? What If SARUMAN managed to get his hands on the One Ring and how that effects all events afterwards! He only knew an orc band was loose and could cause problems and he feared an alliance between Saruman and Sauron which would be bad for Rohan so off he went. He said yes!" The pair had met through mutual friends years ago, but had an immediate spark when they reconnected last year. In any event, a confrontation between Saruman and Sauron seems as though it would not be a closely fought as the one between Gandalf and Sauron described above; Gandalf was able to cast-out Saruman, so it seems as though Sauron would have more easily had the upper-hand in such a contest. What would have happened if the Balrog of Moria had taken possession of The One Ring? It seems it was a mistake for the Ring to leave Isildur. Who is more popular Leonardo DiCaprio or Tom Cruise? He also had control of the nine kings and such or was supposed to, although didn't Elrond get a ring yet was present at the battle? Narsil was made by the dwarves not elves. So, it seems Sauron is not invincible, even with the ring, much less against it. I never really understood how they fit into the picture - I presume the nine gave to their bearers some ability, but ultimately corrupted them and turned them into the nazgul, which I guess was their purpose. You must log in or register to reply here. Their power was in preserving and healing the hurts done to the earth, and to those who were harmed by evil. Much of Sarumans history in the Second Age is mysterious. So all of the vanilla staves will get a retexture that adds a new color depending on their enchantment. Is Taco Bell healthier than other fast food? Other uncategorized cookies are those that are being analyzed and have not been classified into a category as yet. Functional cookies help to perform certain functionalities like sharing the content of the website on social media platforms, collect feedbacks, and other third-party features. It's a good question. The Silmarillion says, In the likeness of men they appeared, old but vigorous. Only Crdan the Shipwright knew Sarumans identity. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for LEGO The Lord of the Rings Tower of Orthanc (10237) at the best online prices at eBay! By this Tolkien shows that disobedience for good reasons has merit. However, Saruman had planned his rise to power much earlier than that. Sauron was much the stronger, but a lot of his power is in the ring. Frodo would have continued into Mordor and odds are he would have been discovered there. I don't think we have enough information to answer this with certainty. Now, consider Saruman. In Unfinished Tales, J.R.R. By the time of The Lord of the Rings, Saruman has become jealous of Saurons power (and Gandalfs too). Director Peter Jackson adapted the books into six films divided into two trilogies The Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit.More popularly referred to as The Lord of the Rings movies, watching them in chronological order helps viewers place certain disparate events . Today we jump back in time to one of our older videos at one of our What If scenarios! Saruman knew good and well what would happen when he tried holding Gandalf. RELATED: Thranduil Was a Jerk - But Lord of the Rings' Only Dark Elf Was Actually Evil. Too well studied, as it turned out, for Saruman gradually turned to evil himself, emulating Sauron's works. He reasoned that his total control of Middle . ncdu: What's going on with this second size column? Sauron would also realize the captured Halflings did not have the Ring so all the doubt surrounding Aragorn having it would be absent. But maybe thats a reason why hes Saruman and not Gandalf. We know of his ultimate betrayal against Middle-earth, maybe especially against his fellow Wizards and the Valar. I got down on bended knee at the top of the mountain and proposed. He and his servants already knew of his involvement in the attack on the Fellowship and the capture of the hobbits. Some interesting conjecture, but you're forgetting that if anyone replaced Sauron as the "master" of the One Ruling Ring, they would sever Sauron's tie to the ring and essentially reduce him to an ineffectual spirit who could no longer interact with the physical world. While Frodo and his companions know that Sauron is an embodiment of . Frodo was a hobbit with one companion, in the heart of Sauron's realm. What if: One of the primarch's had landed on the world of Avatar the Last Airbender. Do new devs get fired if they can't solve a certain bug? The Vanyar were one of the tribes/families of the elves. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. The Palantri. We'll pick u. If Gandalf proved the victor, the result would have been for Sauron the same as the destruction of the Ring; for him it would have been destroyed, taken from him for ever. Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0, TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History, Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News. The Eye of Sauron is one of the most iconic symbols associated with J.R.R. Seem's strange when the ring's main purpose was to rule over the rings/leaders? Gil Galad, and the last alliance also defeated Sauron, without the help of the Maiar, as well. When the White Council was formed around T.A. She's an Elf, So Has a Very Long Lifespan. Did she think she could have avoided being drawn to Sauron if she did seize the Ring? Gandalf was hand-selected and sent by Manw. These cookies help provide information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc. What would have happened to Saruman if Sauron acquired the One Ring? My understanding of the crushingly unavoidable fate which is the history of Middle Earth says that the One Ring belongs to Sauron and no other. In the chaos Eomer created, two hobbits managed to escape with the help of a greedy orc and met with an ancient being which in turn led to the ruin of Saruman. I know Letter 246 says Sauron himself did not fear the Ring, would not have hesitated to confront a Ring-wielding Frodo, and could easily have forced Frodo to hand the Ring over. Tolkein himself said that it would have been a difficult battle, and might have gone either way, but that One of the true great powers could have dedfeated Sauron by using the Ring. When Gandalf sent Frodo and the Hobbits to Bree in The Lord of the Rings' opening act, he had the fullest intent of meeting them there. It's much more likely that Saruman would have used the One Ring for himself and tried to claim Middle-earth as his own. If you preorder a special airline meal (e.g. What percentage of recruits fail boot camp? Was the "Eye of Sauron" Sauron's actual physical form? Sauron is the primary villain of The Lord Of The Rings. Sauron originally made the One Ring to enhance his ability to influence and suppress or control the wills of other beings, specifically the Children of Ilvatar (Elves, Dwarves, and Men). It's interesting here that since both Sauron and Saruman were in origin Maiar of Aule, they may be expected to have some knowledge of each other, and that they would have some idea of each other's strengths and weaknesses. If Saruman destroyed Sauron If he won, he would become a great L. I imagine it'd be a similar situation as if Gandalf or Saruman got The Ring. Furthermore, Saruman knows more about ring-lore than any other being in Middle Earth at the time, save only Sauron himself, and he had already made himself a minor ring, so he would learn how to use it quickly. What is a word for the arcane equivalent of a monastery? Behind Naruto, Gandalf stood straighter, and began to comb his beard with his fingers. He would have learned what very few people knew - the actual objective of the Quest of the Ring, that it was being taken to Mt. What happens next would depend on Sauron himself; whether he would seek to retake the Ring immediately; whether he would visit Saruman himself or send a lesser servant. Seem's strange when the ring's main purpose was to rule over the rings/leaders? The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Analytics". He will likely go through some things, but that would mean the Gandalf we meet in the Second Age is largely the same as the Gandalf in the Third Age. Sauron was the master ring-maker in LOTR, but Saruman also forged a ring of power so that he could eventually challenge the Dark Lord. By the time we meet Saruman in The Lord of the Rings, hes up to no good. He definitely volunteered to go to Middle-earth first. By clicking Accept All, you consent to the use of ALL the cookies. If he would have been strong enough to control the ring, what would have happened to Sauron? Because the One Ring was the master to all . RELATED: How Morgoth Created Glaurung and The Lord of the Rings' Dragons. But if The Rings of Power already called dibs on Gandalf's origins, there's always the tale of what the grey wizard got up to between The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings, a story so worthwhile . Saruman also experimented with the making of a Ring of his own. By clicking Post Your Answer, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy. (Letter 246). By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. By the time that happened, little would be left but the ruins of the world in the aftermath of Saurons great war to regain the ring. After a comment from Gimli, Gandalf adds: "But Isengard cannot fight Mordor, unless Saruman first obtains the Ring. Five wizards came to Middle-earth, so the Stranger could be any of them. "Greetings, Naruto Wraithslayer, wielder of the Faerdagnir. That he will never do now." Saruman with the Ring would presumably have tried to do what Tolkien says Galadriel or Gandalf might have done, if they have succumbed to the temptation of accepting the Ring: See Palantr Wikipedia . Not true. Rings of Power (and a touch of Wheel of Time), Ignore/Block Essentials, Paid Registrations by. cbr.com - Blake Hawkins 14h. For all things Tolkien, Lord of The Rings, and The Hobbit Press J to jump to the feed. I'm no Tolkien expert but I assume there would have been a great war between Isengard and Mordor, which would have affected all parts of Middle Earth. There's the slight possibility that Saruman would have given the One Ring to Sauron and served as lieutenant to the most powerful being in Middle-earth.